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-   -   Phoenix Homes (http://www.buildinghomes.ca/community/forums/showthread.php?t=3223)

pinktulips 2007-03-09 08:40 AM

Phoenix Homes
 
Hey there,

Just wondering if any of you knew anything about Phoenix Homes. They seem to have great value for what they offer you. I'm just not sure what their reputation is and wanted to hear any positive/negative experiences you may have heard about or gone through with them.

mart242 2007-03-09 09:10 AM

Run my friend... run.. don't walk. run. That's what it used to be.

I'd say go knock on some doors of recently built homes and ask the homeowners. Maybe things have changed.

TSB 2007-03-09 10:11 AM

We just bought a Phoenix home, closing date of September 14, 2007.

We knocked on doors in Barrhaven prior to buying it, and everyone seemed happy that they bought it. No matter what builder you go with, nothing will be perfect. I have yet to hear of one builder where absolutely nothing needed to be fixed after the house was built. While the people we talked to had minor repairs, none of them had any major repairs, and said that everything was fixed quickly. One of the owners was on their second Phoenix home, and not one person we talked to regretted their decision in buying a Phoenix home.

I will say, however, that the staff at the Design Centre people are lacking in customer service skills.

Joseph 2007-03-09 12:13 PM

I have a close friend who is having a home built by Phoenix Homes in Barrhaven. So far, he has not had a very good experience with them. He has asked for a number of changes to the floor plan of the house they are building. According to him, Phoenix is not interested in making changes (he is getting them to move some windows around in some rooms, better use of space to include a closet, etc). But, what he wanted (and Phoenix had agreed to do) is not what the trades people are doing. So there is a lot of "frustration" on both side.

As with a lot of other builders, as long as you do not need changes to the floor plan (except maybe for some minor things), things should go well. In the end, the quality is only as good as the trades people working on it and the building supervisor overseeing the work for your new home.

GreyingJay 2007-03-09 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph (Post 26682)
I have a close friend who is having a home built by Phoenix Homes in Barrhaven. So far, he has not had a very good experience with them. He has asked for a number of changes to the floor plan of the house they are building. According to him, Phoenix is not interested in making changes (he is getting them to move some windows around in some rooms, better use of space to include a closet, etc). But, what he wanted (and Phoenix had agreed to do) is not what the trades people are doing. So there is a lot of "frustration" on both side.

As with a lot of other builders, as long as you do not need changes to the floor plan (except maybe for some minor things), things should go well. In the end, the quality is only as good as the trades people working on it and the building supervisor overseeing the work for your new home.

You'd think that after hundreds of years of building houses, we would be good at it by now :)

I suspect it is this sort of reason (and their added hassle, cost, time, stress) that certain builders have simply adopted "no changes allowed whatsoever" policies, or provide only specific sets of changes rather than having things customized to each house. Of course, then we buyers complain about the lack of flexibility... :rolleyes:

pinktulips 2007-03-09 02:01 PM

Hmm, thanks for the replies. Sounds like I will definitely have to do some more research. I'm thinking of the Notting Hill site in Orleans. Will try and ask around at their Deer Run location.

TMA28 2007-04-09 03:39 PM

I currently live in a Phoenix house. It did have some poor craftmanship but Phoenix did fix most of the problems. I've got to say that the fine detail in Phoenix isn't there but for the most part, the house isn't too bad. I think their designs are very open and you get a lot of space for your buck. They did delay in the closing date but did offer compensation.

ShowStopper 2007-04-30 09:48 PM

They are one of THEE worst builders in Ottawa. They are notorious for NOT paying their trades. Apparently all of their trades at Brookside left because they didn't pay them. Drive along their street there, they don't have ONE house started and are delaying ALL of their customers. Someone in my office was dumb enough to buy from them.

TMA28 2007-04-30 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShowStopper (Post 28921)
They are one of THEE worst builders in Ottawa. They are notorious for NOT paying their trades. Apparently all of their trades at Brookside left because they didn't pay them. Drive along their street there, they don't have ONE house started and are delaying ALL of their customers. Someone in my office was dumb enough to buy from them.

I don't think Phoenix is that bad nor would I reccommend them but I also wouldn't reccommend a lot of other builders. I know Phoenix is good with delaying their closing dates. I currently live in a Phoenix house right now and its just as average as richcraft and etc.

aikejon 2007-05-01 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mart242 (Post 26665)
Run my friend... run.. don't walk. run. That's what it used to be.

I'd say go knock on some doors of recently built homes and ask the homeowners. Maybe things have changed.


I did this last fall in Barrhaven (I may have posted this elsewhere).... one should still run.... the stories of delays and workmanship were the worst I've ever heard... the guy said that Phoenix even sued a recent owner (neighbour) to get her to shut up.... how bad does THAT have to be....

The first Phoenix site I looked at was in Deer Run, and the rep told me that I wasn't allowed to speak to the owners around the corner because they got angry when people hassled them. I first thought that it would be normal if hordes of people showed up at your doorstep asking silly questions.... but then I did that for other builders in other developments and found that people were generally happy to answer questions about their new homes. I know now why the Phoenix homeowners were angry....

mart242 2007-05-01 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aikejon (Post 28940)
but then I did that for other builders in other developments and found that people were generally happy to answer questions about their new homes. I know now why the Phoenix homeowners were angry....

Yeah, I've answered questions of a quite a few people / potential buyers. Most owners are glad to help.

canabiz 2007-05-03 08:50 PM

Phoenix Homes has an ad in the latest *New Homes* insert from Ottawa Sun (dated April 21, 2007) stating about 75% of its singles in Strandherd Meadows has been sold and prices start at $257,000

Does anyone have any more info on these singles ? I believe granite kitchen countertops and granite foyer are standard in Phoenix singles now. Also Free Hardwood Bonus available. I'll probably go with my cousin (he's house-hunting) this weekend for another drive out there again!

ShowStopper 2007-05-03 09:50 PM

The granite they include is crap. They only include it because the owner of the company owns a granite factory in India. It is super thin. They have vinyl floor in the kitchen so unless you are ready to upgrade your kitchen floor, what is the point. And if they crap out on the installation, it looks like total junk.
They won't let you get a credit for the countertop and granite foyer to put towards something else...

mart242 2007-05-04 06:32 AM

granite = people think that it's impressive. It attracts people and that's what they need. A lot of home buyers just look at the eye candy when buying. Not many people take the time to go into the model house basement and see the structural stuff... which is what they should be doing!

Joseph 2007-05-04 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShowStopper (Post 29113)
The granite they include is crap. They only include it because the owner of the company owns a granite factory in India. It is super thin.

About a year or so ago, Phoenix home bought The Granite Shop here in Ottawa. The reason given was so they could include granite coutertop in the kitchen and granite flooring in the entrance as a standard.

I've not been to a model home to see what the quality looks like.

But from a marketing perspective, its one way they can be different from the rest. ;)

aikejon 2007-05-04 12:36 PM

It entices people to sign, to be blind to legion stories of year-long delivery delays, etc. It isn't big enough an upgrade in my opinion to put up with Phoenix if even a few of the stories are true... I'd rather pay an extra $5K-$10K to a builder that will deliver on time.

Molson_g 2007-05-05 02:12 PM

Speaking of Pheonix, We were looking in the Brookside development as my wife and I really like what is going in there, we have been looking at Garand Homes, Has anyone heard of this builder? or any stories?

We were speaking with the owner directly and liked what he had to say. He also had some townhomes nearly completed, and walked us throught those. We were very impressed with the qualilty and how the homes were built. I guess the good thing is him being a smaller builder you deal directly with him as he mentioned to us.

Joseph 2007-05-05 02:22 PM

Molson - you may want to start a new thread to talk about Garand Homes. Otherwise its just going to mickup 2 threads into one. (once you have a new thread started, edit you post to link to the new thread)

mart242 2007-05-05 10:01 PM

BAsed on what I've heard from my inspector, Garand is one of the best in Ottawa. If you like their location (ie: brookside), I'd go for it.

Molson_g 2007-05-10 12:18 AM

I was out at the Brookside site this past weekend and all of the builders are really moving along, some homes ready to move into, and Pheonix hasn't even put a shovel in the ground yet. If i bought from them in there I would be really worried as they already seem to be 5-6 months behind schedule. I don't know what is going on but hopefully they correct it soon and get things on track.

mart242 2007-05-10 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molson_g (Post 29428)
I was out at the Brookside site this past weekend and all of the builders are really moving along, some homes ready to move into, and Pheonix hasn't even put a shovel in the ground yet. If i bought from them in there I would be really worried as they already seem to be 5-6 months behind schedule. I don't know what is going on but hopefully they correct it soon and get things on track.

Actually, that is great news for those who bought and want to back out. They'll be notified of the delay and can simply cancel their purchase agreement (and get their money back!)

Joseph 2007-05-10 10:38 AM

Do we know if Phoenix has actually sold any homes in that development yet? If so, what sort of closing dates are being given. Maybe they are closing much later because all their trades are working at some other development site?

aikejon 2007-05-10 01:32 PM

I have heard rumours (just rumours) that they have trouble keeping trades because they pay them carp.

Compare that to my current builder who has had the same tradesmen for 20-25 years and they pay them well. One day I waived my conditions, the next morning there was a hole (a perfectly dug hole too, I must say). The next working day there were (deep) footings. A week or so later I had a backfilled and watersealed foundation. A week or so after that they were starting to frame the second floor.... and not a chainsaw in sight, and interestingly no nail guns either. In 25 years they tell me they have never missed a single scheduled closing date, not ever, not even by one day. They build between 20 and 60 homes per year...so they're only slightly smaller than Phoenix (30-140 homes per year).

There may be good reasons, maybe none of the negative speculation is true, ...but it makes one wonder...

Joseph 2007-05-10 01:41 PM

aikejon - who is your builder?

GreyingJay 2007-05-10 01:50 PM

Just for fun I did a Google Groups search on Phoenix Homes in Ottawa. A couple of newsgroups (ott.housing, ott.*, etc.) matched, and some quick reading confirms that nothing has changed.

E.g. folks posted threads years ago that read exactly like this one. "I'm due to close soon and they haven't even dug a hole yet, there's no possibly way they will close on time".

canabiz 2007-05-10 01:56 PM

The latest issue of New Homes and Condos (that you can pick up for free) advertises the following builder for Brookside (Kanata)

Garand
Holitzner
Monarch
Muirfield
and Phoenix

I don't have any personal experience with Phoenix so I will reserve my judgements but looking at that list there, there seems to be quite a few *heavyweights* in there i.e. builders with good track record so my point is if you want to reside in Brookside and if you are not comfortable with Phoenix, either from your own research or from other people's inputs, you do have quite a few other options.

Cheers!

aikejon 2007-05-10 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph (Post 29465)
aikejon - who is your builder?

Mélanie Constructions - Russell Tp.

yourhighness1 2007-05-18 02:25 PM

Phoenix Not Honouring Closing Dates
 
I only wish I had seen this post before I purchased my new home from Phoenix at the Brookside site. Just found out late last week that my closing is being delayed by 7 weeks and my parents (who also bought a property from Phoenix) are being delayed by 3 months. Might not have been so catastrophic had I not just sold my current house. :(

yourhighness1 2007-05-18 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joseph (Post 29441)
Do we know if Phoenix has actually sold any homes in that development yet? If so, what sort of closing dates are being given. Maybe they are closing much later because all their trades are working at some other development site?

There are probably about 21+ properties sold by Phoenix at Brookside so far. If you go to mybrookside.com and check out the site maps for the various builders, it will give you an idea of which lots are already sold by builder. To my knowledge closings were supposed to start in early September and on into October. Not looking too good right about now.

yourhighness1 2007-05-18 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mart242 (Post 29432)
Actually, that is great news for those who bought and want to back out. They'll be notified of the delay and can simply cancel their purchase agreement (and get their money back!)

I thought the purchase agreements were written so that the buyer couldn't back out. I thought I was locked in.

GreyingJay 2007-05-18 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yourhighness1 (Post 29921)
I thought the purchase agreements were written so that the buyer couldn't back out. I thought I was locked in.

There are laws about how much notice and how long a delay the builders can give you. Relatively short delays are allowed so long as the builders provide sufficient notice. A "medium" length delay is allowed but you must be compensated. At a certain point you are given the option to walk away.

Forgive me, I have no numbers, but some else will surely chime in with details.

J&A 2007-05-18 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yourhighness1 (Post 29921)
I thought the purchase agreements were written so that the buyer couldn't back out. I thought I was locked in.

You're protected by Tarion, I think it's summed up very well here:
http://www.tarion.com/HOME/New+Home+...eholdHomes.htm

Wow I just noticed on the bottom of that page that if you sign any ammendments or anything for the builder, you may be waiving your rights. And after a 120 day delay you only have 9 days to decide to terminate, or the whole cycle starts over again. I guess you have to be *really* careful.

mart242 2007-05-18 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreyingJay (Post 29922)
Forgive me, I have no numbers, but some else will surely chime in with details.

I think that it's ~130 days or something like that. If you get a notice from them about your delay, DO NOT sign that you agree to it otherwise you can't back out unless they give you another 120 - 130 days delay notice

Molson_g 2007-05-22 12:01 AM

Was there again on the weekend checking on how my house was coming along and Pheonix did not even have a hole in the ground yet.

yourhighness1 2007-05-22 07:55 AM

Starting the digging this week....
 
Apparently Phoenix is starting to dig this week (I've been quoted that they are supposed to start today). Fingers crossed. If you were out to Brookside on the weekend you probably noticed that the lots are now marked with street numbers. I'm hoping that this is to tell the construction crew where to start digging.

Molson_g 2007-05-23 12:27 AM

yourhighness1, I know all the streets are marked but did not notice the lots marked as I have a different builder however I did notice marking pegs and the construction site office is there (that's a good sign) . I hope they start soon as they are at least 5-6 months behind all the others already.

I know my house is supposed to be ready by mid June and I'am sure some of the other builders are looking at that time frame as well. I know if I saw others moving in I'd be getting really anxious to get in as well.


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